Hello,
I am currently in the midst of moving across the country for work and as part of the move my family is spending a few weeks at my inlaws house. Including pre release weekend, as such I have been looking around at local stores pre releases to decide where to play and I noticed one of them had listed that they were giving out prize packs in SOI boosters. Which seemed odd as WOTC gives LGS product of the set being released for prizes. I also noticed on their sight that they were having a raffle for a BFZ fat pack. So three questions am I correct that the prize pool looks fishy? Should I contact a WPN rep about it? And is the raffle against the gambling policy?

In Germany, it's always been this way:


—- above this line, edited —-


Stores are encouraged to give out additional product as prize support. From WotC, they receive Prerelease product which includes prizes in form of TWO Eldritch Moon packs per player. This means as long as the store provides (overall) at least 2 prizepacks Eldritch Moon per player, and only non-Eldritch-Moon product as additional prize support, that should be fine.

It is NOT OK to give out zero Eldritch Moon prizes.
It is OK to give out 2 EMO(per player) + SOI packs as prizes.
It is not OK to give out more than 2 EMO packs(per player) as prizes

About the raffle, that seems like a legal problem of Canada if any, not a mtg policy problem. Offering a raffle/door prize as part of an event is pretty common in other countries however.

Within the prerelease kit, the TO will also receive instructions of what to exactly do with the prizes.
The instructions for previous sets were like:
“DO NOT give out more than 2 packs per player”
“DO NOT give out less than 2 packs per player”
“DO give any non-EMO product if you want to”

Edited Philip Böhm (July 3, 2016 04:24:11 AM)

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

Stores are encouraged to give out additional product as prize support. From WotC, they receive Prerelease product which includes prizes in form of TWO Eldritch Moon packs per player. This means as long as the store provides (overall) at least 2 prizepacks Eldritch Moon per player, and only non-Eldritch-Moon product as additional prize support, that should be fine.

It is NOT OK to give out zero Eldritch Moon prizes.
It is OK to give out 2 EMO(per player) + SOI packs as prizes.
It is not OK to give out more than 2 EMO packs(per player) as prizes

About the raffle, that seems like a legal problem of Canada if any, not a mtg policy problem. Offering a raffle/door prize as part of an event is pretty common in other countries however.

Within the prerelease kit, the TO will also receive instructions of what to exactly do with the prizes.
The instructions for previous sets were like:
“DO NOT give out more than 2 packs per player”
“DO NOT give out less than 2 packs per player”
“DO give any non-EMO product if you want to”

I guess I should clarify the prize listing did not include and emn packs and the raffle was a paid for side raffle not a free door prize draw.

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

It is not OK to give out more than 2 EM(N) packs(per player) as prizes

Is this correct? I haven't looked at the TO instructions, but for the longest time I've had the impression that a TO could use all their allocated prerelease packs as prizes.

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

From WotC, they receive Prerelease product which includes prizes in form of TWO Eldritch Moon packs per player. This means as long as the store provides (overall) at least 2 prizepacks Eldritch Moon per player, and only non-Eldritch-Moon product as additional prize support, that should be fine.

For what feels like about two years now the prize support of at least 2 boosters per player has changed from being mandatory to being a recommendation according to the prerelease documents WPN releases. I haven't seen them for EMN yet, but I would be surprised if they had gone back to making it a mandatory minimum again.

Here's the instructions for Shadows over Innistrad: http://wpn.wizards.com/sites/wpn/files/attachements/prerelease_en.pdf (27 mb slow download)

From the instructions:
“What Should I Include in My Prize Pool?
We recommend at least 2 Shadows over Innistrad booster packs for each player in the event.
We encourage you to add other non-Shadows over Innistrad prize support (at your own discretion).”

Originally posted by Dominik Chłobowski:

Is this correct? I haven't looked at the TO instructions, but for the longest time I've had the impression that a TO could use all their allocated prerelease packs as prizes.

What happens if i provide, let's say 36 packs as prize support for players and increase the cost of the event by 80 € (or whatever a box costs?). Essentially, one is then selling product before the release. That is not wanted.

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

What happens if i provide, let's say 36 packs as prize support for players and increase the cost of the event by 80 € (or whatever a box costs?). Essentially, one is then selling product before the release. That is not wanted.

I don't think stores get their deliveries of boxes until after the prerelease, so it's only prerelease product that they could conceivably sell in the first place. Increasing the price and the prizes accordingly is probably ok, but the store is likely to lose out on attendance as players focus on the up front cost. If there was a truly weird set up though then contacting a WPN rep is the way to go. It's not much of a Judge matter.

Just making clear: It is not OK to give out a different amount than 2 packs of EMO per participant, edit: in Germany)

as Espen Skarsbø Olsen quoted from the SOI Prerelease kit.

Any non-EMO packs can be of any quantity.

For Dragon's Maze, TOs were encouraged to give out more than 2 packs.

Edited Philip Böhm (July 3, 2016 04:24:57 AM)

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

It is not OK to give out a different amount than 2 packs of EMO per participant

Actually, you cannot give less, but you can give more. Imagine a store with 36 prerelease kit allocation (+ they receive 2 booster boxes for free as prizes from WotC). In case the combined attendance at their prerelease events is less than 36 players, any leftover boosters can be also used as prizes (for first places? in a raffle?).

But as some already has said. This is not a judge issue, but a TO/Store Owner Issue and something to talk to WPN about. The WPN can be contacted via email and telephone, and you can see how to contact them here: http://wpn.wizards.com/en/contact-us

When they deal with issues, they usually deal with them in a very quiet matter directly with the store.

Originally posted by Philip Böhm:

Just making clear: It is not OK to give out a different amount than 2 packs of EMO per participant, as Espen Skarsbø Olsen quoted from the SOI Prerelease kit.

Any non-EMO packs can be of any quantity.

I still disagree on this.

This is the quote you refer to:
“What Should I Include in My Prize Pool?
We recommend at least 2 Shadows over Innistrad booster packs for each player in the event.
We encourage you to add other non-Shadows over Innistrad prize support (at your own discretion).”

The word recommended isn't in there to look nice, it's there to set a guideline of what has worked well in the past. If they wanted you to give no more and no less than two they would have said "We require you to give out 2 booster packs of the relevant set.
Since it is a recommendation and not a requirement you can give more or even fewer boosters as you see fit.

Edited Quinten van de Vrie (June 30, 2016 07:55:42 PM)

Philip, if you're going to “make it clear”, please provide a clear
supporting quote from any kind of document. Espen's link suggests
otherwise, and Mark's comment is also correct (to the best of my knowledge)
about stores only receiving Prerelease product before the Prerelease.

Edit: Sorry, I missed the attempt to quote Espen's quote, but in any case, it does suggest otherwise.

2016-06-30 8:53 GMT-04:00 Quinten van de Vrie <

Edited Dominik Chłobowski (July 1, 2016 06:15:47 AM)

Yeah, a lot of the game stores here in Australia (at least NSW) do 2 packs per win at pre-releases (of the new stuff, not old stuff). This has been happening for years now and is pretty well publicised by stores through social media. As far as I know I've never walked away from a pre-release with only 2 packs of the new set in prizes.

__

Edited Sean Crain (July 1, 2016 07:04:58 AM)

You are explicitly provided 2 packs per person by WOTC for prize support. Giving out any less than 2 per person seems entirely inappropriate, and likely an issue with the TO/LGS owner that ought to be talked about.