There is a local shop that has “house rules” that you can't draw into the finals or draw to split 1st/2nd. They make the players play it out or forfeit 1st place prize. Their stand is players came here to play, so play. I had never seen this before, and it was just repeated at the prerelease. I have talked to them, but they are firm. The players have asked if this is allowed. I told them I would look into it.

report the shop to WOTC please

I would show them the section 2.4 of the MTR:

2.4 Conceding or Intentionally Drawing Games or Matches
If a game or match is not completed, players may concede or mutually agree to a draw in that game or match. A
match is considered complete once the result slip is filled out or, if match slips are not being used, a player leaves
the table after game play is finished. Until that point, either player may concede to or draw with the other, though
if the conceding player won a game in the match, the match must be reported as 2-1. Intentional draws are always
reported as 0-0-3.

Explain to them that ID's are allowed under MTR policy, and they shouldn't forbid players from legal practices.

Edited Jeff S Higgins (Feb. 3, 2014 07:46:38 AM)

That was in my discussion with them. That's when I got the came here to play comment.

One of the best counter arguements against “They came to play” is that while the player have come to play, these players have done very well so far today so allowing them to draw in the last few rounds is a reward for doing well.

pretty sure the best counter argument to that is “if you don't allow
intentional draws, your store will lose its privilege to run magic
tournaments.”

I've found the best way to work with stores is by making sure they realize you're on their side. If you go to a store and say, “Do X or you'll get in trouble with Wizards”, it is easy for the store to see you as a troublemaker. The trick is to be seen as someone who is on their side and trying to help. “I know you don't like intentional draws, but I checked and they have to be legal. And determined players will just be able to play for 50 minutes and get an unintentional draw. Now instead let's talk about changing the prize structure to discourage drawing.”

Kevin

and while he is right, the players generally came to play, this is not anymore true for the that want to draw. Intentionally by itself means that both agree that they don't want to play this final round anymore, so why forbid them to to so?

Even if store want to forbid intentional draw, and even when store do any possible effort for that, there are always some ways to draw for players. Basically store cannot forbid ID in reality.

So, as a store, best way to avoid ID is making prize structure so that make players play. In many prerelease tournament, prize is awarded based on points instead of rank for this reason. Offering ID for split is not arrowed in MTR, so basically many players will play on.

As a player, they can suggest this solution to organizer. “You don't need to make effort to watch players to keep them from IDing. Just change some prize structure. Then all of us are happy! ”

Kevin and Kenji are correct - don't threaten, help them figure out alternatives.

And, if they still don't listen, please inform Wizards Customer Service. (But, you still don't want to threaten them, or even let them know it was you…)

Ok, that's where it's at. It's obvious if the players are drawing out the game to force the draw, and they don't want to get banned from playing. Thank you.

This comes up constantly.

1) Like everyone else said, don't threaten. You will just look silly.
2) Unenforceable rules just penalize the honest people who try to live
by them. They also make it more acceptable to ignore other rules,
because you step over the line, doing unauthorized things tend to be
less taboo.
3) DCI rules only apply to sanctioned events. A TO can do whatever
they want in an unsanctioned event. Make sure that you point out the
distinction in any sort of discussion about this. The TO has a choice
of sanctioning an event according to DCI rules or holding a
non-sanctioned event according to “house rules.” That goes over a lot
better than “you have to do things my way!”
4) Lots and lots of people dislike what they see as not sporting and
collusionary activity. As has been pointed out lots of times, the DCI
rules just prohibit unsporting behavior, they do not require sporting
behavior. You can't call your opponent names. Nothing requires you to
wish them good luck or even talk to them at all.
5) TOs have a lot of ways of encouraging a communal atmosphere at
their events, including booting obnoxious people from the store.
Depending on the atmosphere of the local community, highly competitive
behavior can be considered obnoxious. That is not governed by the DCI.
6) There are many ways of discouraging highly competitive behavior.
Highly competitive players tend to be bad for the bottom line. They
suck up prizes on a constant basis and spend less money in general.
There are a whole host of things that can make highly competitive
players avoid your store while staying within the rules.
A. Flat prize structures. If first place only wins back your entry or
even less, you can't “go infinite.” Competitive players hate that.
B. Do not allow store credit to be used for entry fees. Competitive
players hate that, since they generally don't want to fork out cash.
Which coincidentally happens to be one of the reasons TOs don't like
to have them in the store.
C. Use fewer than the recommended number of rounds for the tournaments
that allow them, do not pair within pods for tournaments that allow
them. Use the alternative play-draw rules for tournaments that allow
them. Use Swiss+1 instead of a cut for tournaments that allow them.
Use sealed rather than draft pools when the tournament allows it.
Competitive players hate all of those.
D. Use alternative prize structures. There is nothing that says coming
first place in the rankings according to WER means you get the most
prizes. You can give out prizes based on number of match wins, number
of rares in deck, number of Forests in the deck, number of opponents
who checked off “this was a fun game” on the result slip, etc. Just
announce the prize structure before you start. I am kind of partial to
a prize structure based on the number of game wins minus the number of
Islands in your deck. :P

Originally posted by Jacob Faturechi:

This comes up constantly.

1) Like everyone else said, don't threaten. You will just look silly.
2) Unenforceable rules just penalize the honest people who try to live
by them. They also make it more acceptable to ignore other rules,
because you step over the line, doing unauthorized things tend to be
less taboo.
3) DCI rules only apply to sanctioned events. A TO can do whatever
they want in an unsanctioned event. Make sure that you point out the
distinction in any sort of discussion about this. The TO has a choice
of sanctioning an event according to DCI rules or holding a
non-sanctioned event according to “house rules.” That goes over a lot
better than “you have to do things my way!”
4) Lots and lots of people dislike what they see as not sporting and
collusionary activity. As has been pointed out lots of times, the DCI
rules just prohibit unsporting behavior, they do not require sporting
behavior. You can't call your opponent names. Nothing requires you to
wish them good luck or even talk to them at all.
5) TOs have a lot of ways of encouraging a communal atmosphere at
their events, including booting obnoxious people from the store.
Depending on the atmosphere of the local community, highly competitive
behavior can be considered obnoxious. That is not governed by the DCI.
6) There are many ways of discouraging highly competitive behavior.
Highly competitive players tend to be bad for the bottom line. They
suck up prizes on a constant basis and spend less money in general.
There are a whole host of things that can make highly competitive
players avoid your store while staying within the rules.
A. Flat prize structures. If first place only wins back your entry or
even less, you can't “go infinite.” Competitive players hate that.
B. Do not allow store credit to be used for entry fees. Competitive
players hate that, since they generally don't want to fork out cash.
Which coincidentally happens to be one of the reasons TOs don't like
to have them in the store.
C. Use fewer than the recommended number of rounds for the tournaments
that allow them, do not pair within pods for tournaments that allow
them. Use the alternative play-draw rules for tournaments that allow
them. Use Swiss+1 instead of a cut for tournaments that allow them.
Use sealed rather than draft pools when the tournament allows it.
Competitive players hate all of those.
D. Use alternative prize structures. There is nothing that says coming
first place in the rankings according to WER means you get the most
prizes. You can give out prizes based on number of match wins, number
of rares in deck, number of Forests in the deck, number of opponents
who checked off “this was a fun game” on the result slip, etc. Just
announce the prize structure before you start. I am kind of partial to
a prize structure based on the number of game wins minus the number of
Islands in your deck. :P

This is an awesome post, seriously!! :) The issue LGS-comp players-casual players is a classic discussion everywhere :)

While I agree with the idea of discouraging highly competitive play at FNM, I don't agree with the methodology of discouraging competitive players from playing. I like flat prize structures because almost everyone walks away with something and that makes most people happy. If competitive players feel it's not worth their time, so be it, but that's not my motivation behind it.

If Kibler walked into my store, I wouldn't be turning him away because he's too good. I'd be saying, “Oh heck yes! In fact, would you mind if I introduced you to the players and added a 1-pack prize bounty to anyone who beats you?” Now players are itching for the chance to take on the Pro. If they lose? Yeah well, he's a pro. If they win? “OH MY GOD I BEAT KIBLER AT FNM!!!”

Sounds like fun times to me.

Originally posted by Adam Zakreski:

If Kibler walked into my store, I wouldn't be turning him away because he's too good. I'd be saying, “Oh heck yes! In fact, would you mind if I introduced you to the players and added a 1-pack prize bounty to anyone who beats you?” Now players are itching for the chance to take on the Pro. If they lose? Yeah well, he's a pro. If they win? “OH MY GOD I BEAT KIBLER AT FNM!!!”

I think that would be my reaction too. Put him in and let the LGS loose on him. Definetely, as a TO I'd put a bounty on his head for my guys.