Originally posted by Colleen Nelson:
So even if we technically treat an O-Ring different from a Doomblade, the reality is most players don't.
Edited Toby Hazes (July 31, 2013 12:22:39 AM)
Originally posted by Ashley Puhlman:
If the elves were tapped before announcement, then it was a perfectly legal action. Our job is to undo illegal actions, not stupid ones. For Regular, I can definitely see unwinding. But if you're in a big Comp event, I think unwinding could be viewed as bending the rules for the caster. Also, I thought the explanation of “mana produced for the spell” was only for the mana that was made during the announcement. Maybe that's just thinking too literally?
717.1. If a player realizes that he or she can’t legally take an action after starting to do so, the entire action is reversed and any payments already made are canceled. No abilities trigger and no effects apply as a result of an undone action. If the action was casting a spell, the spell returns to the zone it came from. The player may also reverse any legal mana abilities activated while making the illegal play, unless mana from them or from any triggered mana abilities they triggered was spent on another mana ability that wasn’t reversed. Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
Originally posted by Josh Stansfield:
The “can of worms” can only open so wide, luckily. The Comp Rules include guidance on how to handle the more unusual mana abilities that cause cards to change zones.717.1. If a player realizes that he or she can’t legally take an action after starting to do so, the entire action is reversed and any payments already made are canceled. No abilities trigger and no effects apply as a result of an undone action. If the action was casting a spell, the spell returns to the zone it came from. The player may also reverse any legal mana abilities activated while making the illegal play, unless mana from them or from any triggered mana abilities they triggered was spent on another mana ability that wasn’t reversed. Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
Originally posted by Frank Rodriguez:
But this is not clear on whether or not the activated ability of the Arbor Elf can be reversed. Is it?
Originally posted by Ashley Pullman:Since I decide to rewind the untapping of the arbor elves as if they were mana abilities activated for Trostani, I don't rewind them if they were not activated solely as mana abilities for Trostani. So the fix depends on why the active player explicitly activated them before announcing the spell.
Michel, should the fix really depend on what might happen or what an opponent might be holding?