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Competitive REL » Post: Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

March 31, 2013 06:30:32 PM

Toby Hazes
Judge (Level 2 (Judge Academy)), TLC

BeNeLux

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Yin casts Slaughter Games and names Mountain Goat, of which there are 2 in Yang's graveyard. Yin searches Yang's library and takes out 2 additional Goats. Yang takes the 2 Goats from his graveyard and puts all 4 in the exile zone.

The next turn, Yin casts Surgical Extraction targeting a Dwarven Pony from Yang's graveyard, of which there also are 2 there. She searches Yang's library again and finds 2 more Ponies. This time however Yang only exiles those 2 and leaves the other 2 in his graveyard.

Did Yang do anything wrong here? By resolving part of Yin's effect the first time, does he set up the expectation that this is how any further such effects are handled in the future?

Edited Toby Hazes (March 31, 2013 06:54:11 PM)

March 31, 2013 07:11:45 PM

Shawn Doherty
Judge (Level 5 (Judge Foundry))

USA - Northeast

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

I'd want to know why Yang is removing any of the cards. If he was just trying to be helpful the first time, then no big deal. If he is trying to convince Yin that he is resolving the spell properly, then there may be an investigation needed. Assuming no cheats, Yin has failed to exile cards with the Extraction. Technically he failed to exile the cards with the Games, but I think I'm going to assume that he did want them exiled, so they can stay.

April 1, 2013 01:30:38 AM

Jacob Faturechi
Judge (Uncertified)

USA - Southwest

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Important note: you can only fail to find if you are searching a hidden
zone for a card with a specific attribute.

You cannot fail to find cards in the graveyard with Surgical Extraction.
You cannot Mindslaver your opponent and fail to find when casting Diabolic
Tutor or any of the other tutors that allow you to get any card.
On Mar 31, 2013 4:27 PM, “Toby Hazes” <forum-3588@apps.magicjudges.org>
wrote:

April 1, 2013 01:35:20 AM

Robert Hinrichsen
Judge (Level 3 (Judge Foundry))

Canada

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Originally posted by Jacob Faturechi:

Important note: you can only fail to find if you are searching a hidden
zone for a card with a specific attribute.

You cannot fail to find cards in the graveyard with Surgical Extraction.
You cannot Mindslaver your opponent and fail to find when casting Diabolic
Tutor or any of the other tutors that allow you to get any card.
On Mar 31, 2013 4:27 PM, “Toby Hazes” <forum-3588@apps.magicjudges.org>
wrote:

Failing to find is not relevant here. Both cards in question allow the spell's controller to search for any number of specified cards, which allows them to find 0 cards even in a public zone.

April 1, 2013 01:35:54 AM

Shawn Doherty
Judge (Level 5 (Judge Foundry))

USA - Northeast

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Correct, but you choose any number to exile, so you can choose not to remove some of them.

April 1, 2013 01:48:38 AM

Jacob Faturechi
Judge (Uncertified)

USA - Southwest

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Sorry. I was assuming that Surgical was worded similarly to Extirpate.
On Mar 31, 2013 11:32 PM, “Shawn Doherty” <forum-3588@apps.magicjudges.org>
wrote:

April 1, 2013 06:45:24 AM

Toby Hazes
Judge (Level 2 (Judge Academy)), TLC

BeNeLux

Player exiles cards for opponent's Slaughter Games but later not for Surgical Extraction

Originally posted by Shawn Doherty:

Assuming no cheats, Yin has failed to exile cards with the Extraction. Technically he failed to exile the cards with the Games, but I think I'm going to assume that he did want them exiled, so they can stay.

Let's say that with the Slaughter Games it was originally her intent to take the 2 Goats from the graveyard herself, but while she was searching his library, he already took those 2, so she noticed all 4 being exiled and finished resolving it. With the Extraction, she assumed he would do the same and thus didn't notice how Yang resolved it eventually.

Assuming no cheats, was it Yin's mistake to assume he would follow the same shortcut, or was it Yang's mistake for being inconsistent with the shortcut used?

Edited Toby Hazes (April 1, 2013 06:46:29 AM)

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