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Would a card's trigger ability been triggered by casting itself?
April 28, 2015 10:15:33 PM
- Alex YEUNG
- Judge (Level 3 (Judge Academy))
- Greater China
Would a card's trigger ability been triggered by casting itself?
We have a discussion on the following question.
A control Horn of Greed, which is enchanted by Song of the Dryads. A play Vesuva and have it as a copy of the Forest (Horn of Greed) entered battlefield.
Vesuva now is an artifact of Horn of Greed.
The question is
Would the Horn of Greed (Vesuva)'s trigger ability been triggered by playing Vesuva ?
Some said, when the Horn of Greed is in the battlefield, the trigger timing has already been missed. So it would not be triggered.
Some voices said, due to 603.6d, “Normally, objects that exist immediately after an event are checked to see if the event matched any trigger conditions.”
The objects = Horn of Greed (Vesuva)
The event = play Vesuva
so, it would trigger.
Some said, 603.6 is abt changing zone trigger. Since triggered by land doesn't included, so it should not be applied.
The 2nd question is
would there be any CR to support the answer? And Why 603.6d could / couldn't been applied for this case
Thank you.
A control Horn of Greed, which is enchanted by Song of the Dryads. A play Vesuva and have it as a copy of the Forest (Horn of Greed) entered battlefield.
Vesuva now is an artifact of Horn of Greed.
The question is
Would the Horn of Greed (Vesuva)'s trigger ability been triggered by playing Vesuva ?
Some said, when the Horn of Greed is in the battlefield, the trigger timing has already been missed. So it would not be triggered.
Some voices said, due to 603.6d, “Normally, objects that exist immediately after an event are checked to see if the event matched any trigger conditions.”
The objects = Horn of Greed (Vesuva)
The event = play Vesuva
so, it would trigger.
Some said, 603.6 is abt changing zone trigger. Since triggered by land doesn't included, so it should not be applied.
The 2nd question is
would there be any CR to support the answer? And Why 603.6d could / couldn't been applied for this case
Thank you.
Edited Alex YEUNG (April 28, 2015 10:20:27 PM)
May 13, 2015 01:43:15 PM
- Callum Milne
- Forum Moderator
- Judge (Uncertified)
- Canada - Western Provinces
Would a card's trigger ability been triggered by casting itself?
603.6d explains what the normal procedure for checking for the existence of triggered abilities is so that it can then lay out an exception to that procedure for use in special cases. This is not one of those special cases, so the normal procedure is what applies. And the normal procedure, as described in 603.6d, is that objects that exist immediately after the event are checked to see if the event matched any trigger conditions.
Immediately after Vesuva/Horn of Greed enters the battlefield, the game checks to see if any trigger conditions have been matched. The Vesuva/Horn has an ability that triggers “Whenever a player plays a land…”, and you did indeed just take the special action of playing a land, so the ability triggers. (The fact that you taking the action of playing a land resulted in a non-land permanent entering the battlefield doesn't matter–you still played a land.)
Immediately after Vesuva/Horn of Greed enters the battlefield, the game checks to see if any trigger conditions have been matched. The Vesuva/Horn has an ability that triggers “Whenever a player plays a land…”, and you did indeed just take the special action of playing a land, so the ability triggers. (The fact that you taking the action of playing a land resulted in a non-land permanent entering the battlefield doesn't matter–you still played a land.)