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Competitive REL » Post: Turn one Shenanigans

Turn one Shenanigans

Oct. 9, 2017 08:31:42 PM

Russell Deutsch
Judge (Uncertified)

USA - Northeast

Turn one Shenanigans

Just because everyone is chiming in with answers,

I like GRV/partial fixing this with an improper zone change. Leave the scried cards where they are.

Oct. 10, 2017 12:38:01 AM

Jake Eakle
Judge (Uncertified)

USA - Northeast

Turn one Shenanigans

Originally posted by Florian Horn:

No, that's how we do backups: <rule snipped>
Hm. I missed this in my first post, but it seems like it presents an issue.

What if there are two HFs, and one is in the top 3 and the other isn't? If we just say “take the one that's not,” now it's the case that Abel got to see (maybe draw) an HF with twice the probability he would've if he'd done things in the right order. If we say “take the one that is,” now he'll see an HF among the top three with a much lower chance than he should've, since 2/3 are guaranteed not to be HF.

Oh, and this one is an issue regardless of whether we shuffle the scried/drawn cards or not: what if the only HF is now in hand, because it was drawn and we picked a different card at random?

Oct. 10, 2017 06:27:17 PM

Isaac King
Judge (Uncertified)

Barriere, Canada

Turn one Shenanigans

Originally posted by Florian Horn:

The backup is to put back the two scried cards on top of the library, a random card from the hand on top of these, put the Hallowed Fountain in play, then shuffle the library except the top 3 cards. Then you play from here, and Abel has to cast his Serum Vision, drawing back the card he should have drawn and probably making the same scry decisions.

What if the only Hallowed Fountain in the deck was among the three cards you set aside or the player's hand?

Oct. 10, 2017 06:40:09 PM

Scott Marshall
Forum Moderator
Judge (Level 4 (Judge Foundry)), Hall of Fame

USA - Northwest

Turn one Shenanigans

What if we stop dragging this further & further from the realm of reality, into the deepest, darkest corners?

Oh, wait, that's not what we do in this forum; we focus on the things that are likely to help the thousands of judges, all over the world, who have access to this resource.

A number of interesting ideas have been presented, with justification; while I find some of them to be heavy on the (over?)analysis, and way too strict for this oddball scenario, I still think we've covered all the reasonable outcomes.

So, instead of those other “what ifs” … what if we just wrap this up? Yeah, that's it!

d:^D